TrekWI: TNG was a Failure?

[Emperor Norton I]

Star Trek: The Next Generation is perhaps the most popular Star Trek amongst the general population, with a wildly successful and critically acclaimed run that spawned the series of Star Trek shows that ended with ENTERPRISE. However, when TNG was first starting there was not much hope for it's success.

The Next Generation was a reboot of the Star Trek franchise in it's day, and the general assumption was that it wasn't going to work because Star Trek (the Original Series) was a classic and you can't recapture lightening in a bottle, and you can't do it without the original cast. You can hear this in interview after interview with the actors who were in the cast, who said they didn't expect it would be a success and were told by their agents it wouldn't last past a season if even full way through the first season.

Of course, it was a success and a major one, if only after a bumpy first few seasons (I believe those first couple seasons were not that popular). What if it wasn't? What if it had been like everyone assumed it was going to be and failed to recapture the magic of the original show and failed to be a success?

 

[Garrison]

Well it probably kills most of the TV sci-fi and fantasy of the 90s stone dead. Maybe the X-Files still gets made but I think you can write off Babylon 5 and Stargate SG-1.

 

[Lavanya Six]

What if it wasn't? What if it had been like everyone assumed it was going to be and failed to recapture the magic of the original show and failed to be a success?

It wouldn't be too hard to kill, I think. Just keep Patrick Stewart from playing the part of Picard, and include some of the loopier initial concepts for the show.

As for consequences, they'd be titanic as far as TV sci-fi goes. TNG's failure could be taken as a sign that space opera isn't lucrative on the silver screen. Straczynski might still go through with his initial concept for doing TV science fiction right (epic sweep, while staying on-budget via long-term planning), but Trek's failure could result in something very different from B5. Like if TNG flopped because of one of its loopier ideas -- no Enterprise, just long-range exploration via transporters from a fixed base -- then Straczynski might find a fixed location for his show a hard sell. Assuming anyone's even looking to buy a new sci-fi show.

You'd also butterfly away the careers of writers like Ronald D. Moore and the other folks who got their start with TNG's open script submission.

 

[JVM]

Assuming "Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home" goes as OTL, I think they will blame the new characters and the television medium, and perhaps take a break, butterflying away the original fifth film, and having a different fifth film released in 1991. TNG's failure could butterfly away The Undiscovered Country as of itself, however. Whatever it is, it's marketed as the grand finale of the Trek franchise and the 25th Anniversary film.

If the film's a success or not is a big question. If it is, I imagine they either try doing a Generations-ish film mixing both eras, though with more focus on TOS and/or Kirk, or a reboot ala 2009 in OTL.

If not, well, that's one way to kill the Star Trek franchise.

This would also butterfly away a close friend of mine's cihldhood.

 

[phx1138]

At a minimum, you've butterflied away "DS9" & "ST:E", very probably "ST:V" too. (That last likely saves Kate Mulgrew's marriage. The early end probably saves Patrick's, too.) You've had major career butterflies for Alexander Siddig (he stays a nobody?), Terry Farrell, Nana Visitor, Nicole de Boer (last seen in a slasher film before that AFAIK; she might not get "Dead Zone" TTL), & Roxann Dawson (who certainly is much less likely to be directing TTL), to name just a few offhand. I suspect Shimerman still gets Snyder in "Buffy". Avery Brooks maybe less hurt, after "Spenser" & "Hawk". Michael Dorn could be better off, not being locked into Klingon makeup so much. (With any luck, Brent Spiner, Wil Wheaton, & Marina Sirtis would just disappear...) It also means we aren't subjected to Dwight Schultz's awful Barclay. (I really liked "Madman" Murdock, myself...)

It gets more interesting considering what roles René Auberjonois & Andrew Robinson might get, instead....

I also suspect this means Frakes has to wait to direct, too.

As for "B5" & "SG-1", I'd guess "B5" could get butterflied. "SG-1" was hung on the movie more than "TNG", wasn't it? So if the movie does reasonably well...

What roles these actors had to turn down because of series commitments, tho... Yow, the butterflies. (Factoid: Sirtis appeared as a rape victim in one of the "Death Wish" films...)

 

[A Random Person]

hopefully we could see an American spinoff of Dr. Who

 

[Lavanya Six]

My stab at an alternate, ill-fated TNG:

 

[phx1138]

My stab at an alternate, ill-fated TNG:

With so many Trekkers out there? Just two seasons? Even if it was in the bottom 50? "TOS" was never above 50, IIRC.

 

[doublegoodprole]

Without TNG there would have been no Obama presidency. Future effects include no Second U.S. Civil War from 2015-2020. No Global Warming Riots of 2024. No India/China nuclear war of 2033. No fall of civilization and downfall of society following World War IV in 2052. No cannibalism practiced on a mass scale for centuries. No resurgence of civilization in 3127 CE and no nuclear war that doomed humanity to extinction on January 18, 4325, at 7:03pm EST.

So maybe it wasn't all worth it. But TNG did give us DS9, so I'm okay with the rest.

 

[Mike Stearns]

With so many Trekkers out there? Just two seasons? Even if it was in the bottom 50? "TOS" was never above 50, IIRC.

Agreed, and this cast has Wesley Snipes. He was pretty big in the late 80s and early 90s. That will draw alot of viewers who might not otherwise be interested in Trek. Assuming that Babylon 5 isn't butterflied JMS might feel compelled to one-up Gene Roddenberry and cast Bruce Willis as Garibaldi. Lets face it, there are times in B5 when Garibaldi definetly seems to channeling John McClane.

 

[Lavanya Six]

With so many Trekkers out there? Just two seasons? Even if it was in the bottom 50? "TOS" was never above 50, IIRC.

Fair points. I was just going by the notion of OP's "failed TNG," but given the advantages you mentioned I admit it would take something monumental to kill a revival Star Trek show after two seasons. Like the stars aligning against it from basic concept to casting and scripting.

 

[Emperor Norton I]

You fail to realize the era Star Trek fan reaction of "this won't work" and "how dare you" that preceded and accompanied the first season or two of the Next Generation. Star Trek was "Star Trek", the series of 1966 to 1969. I relay to you a story of Patrick Stewart driving and getting passed by a woman who screamed out "Thanks for wasting my Summer" after the first season.

The Next Generation had to blow those fan assumptions and revulsions away and overcome them.

 

[Carl Schwamberger]

You fail to realize the era Star Trek fan reaction of "this won't work" and "how dare you" that preceded and accompanied the first season or two of the Next Generation. Star Trek was "Star Trek", the series of 1966 to 1969. ...

Reminds me of the story of the Uber Geeks who booed and called "fake" when the puppet Yoda was replaced by a digital animated Yoda

 

[Grey Wolf]

Fair points. I was just going by the notion of OP's "failed TNG," but given the advantages you mentioned I admit it would take something monumental to kill a revival Star Trek show after two seasons. Like the stars aligning against it from basic concept to casting and scripting.

I read that as Far Points...

I wouldn't have been too surprised that if TNG failed, they carried on making films with the original cast until the end of the 1990s. ST IV was very well received, and whilst ST V is a pile of doggydoo, it might benefit from the butterflies

Best Regards
Grey Wolf

 

[alphaboi867]

If TNG failed after only 1 or 2 seasons there was a plan IRL to fold it's episode into TOS's syndication package.

 

[A Random Person]

Without TNG there would have been no Obama presidency. Future effects include no Second U.S. Civil War from 2015-2020. No Global Warming Riots of 2024. No India/China nuclear war of 2033. No fall of civilization and downfall of society following World War IV in 2052. No cannibalism practiced on a mass scale for centuries. No resurgence of civilization in 3127 CE and no nuclear war that doomed humanity to extinction on January 18, 4325, at 7:03pm EST.

So maybe it wasn't all worth it. But TNG did give us DS9, so I'm okay with the rest.

This is actually true...

1. Jeri Ryan wanted to move to Los Angeles after she got the job as Seven of Nine, but her husband at the time, Illinois politician Jack Ryan, objected.
2. A bitter divorce drama plays out in 1999, where the results are sealed in the interests of their child.
3. In 2004, Mr. Ryan campaigns to be the Republican nominee for the U.S. Senate. One of the local papers, acting on a tip, sues to unseal the divorce records.
4. The unsealed records tell stories of Ryan bringing his wife to sex clubs against her will, demanding she have sex with him and strangers in public.
5. Ryan withdraws from the race. His replacement loses the race to the Democratic challenger, a fresh-faced state senator named Barack Hussein Obama.
6. Obama wins the seat, which had been held by Republicans for several terms.
7. Four years later...

 

[mattep74]

Agreed, and this cast has Wesley Snipes. He was pretty big in the late 80s and early 90s. That will draw alot of viewers who might not otherwise be interested in Trek. Assuming that Babylon 5 isn't butterflied JMS might feel compelled to one-up Gene Roddenberry and cast Bruce Willis as Garibaldi. Lets face it, there are times in B5 when Garibaldi definetly seems to channeling John McClane.

The only thing better than OTL Garabaldi would be Willis as Garabaldi. This will butterfly away Colof of night, Die Hard With a Vengeance, Code Mercury and Armageddon among other movies. I also doubt Garabaldi would watch Roadrunner in this scenario

 

[Brady Kj]

I think Star Trek would be easy to kill. Patrick Stewart is nothing like what Gene Roddenberry wanted for Picard, so I'm not sure why he even auditioned. I imagine for extra measure, you could take out Michael Dorn and Brent Spiner, and the series would really struggle. And add a three-breasted Troi.

This would be very bad for science fiction, in both TV and movies. Science Fiction would bounce back eventually, because I think the generation that fell in love with Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles would eventually produce a lot of demand for it.

 

[JVM]

This is actually true...

1. Jeri Ryan wanted to move to Los Angeles after she got the job as Seven of Nine, but her husband at the time, Illinois politician Jack Ryan, objected.
2. A bitter divorce drama plays out in 1999, where the results are sealed in the interests of their child.
3. In 2004, Mr. Ryan campaigns to be the Republican nominee for the U.S. Senate. One of the local papers, acting on a tip, sues to unseal the divorce records.
4. The unsealed records tell stories of Ryan bringing his wife to sex clubs against her will, demanding she have sex with him and strangers in public.
5. Ryan withdraws from the race. His replacement loses the race to the Democratic challenger, a fresh-faced state senator named Barack Hussein Obama.
6. Obama wins the seat, which had been held by Republicans for several terms.
7. Four years later...

All true, except 'held by Republicans for several terms'. Peter Fitzgerald was a one-term Republican Senator, succeeding Carol Moseley Braun, a Democrat who remains highly unpopular, who replaced Alan Dixon, a Democrat who served from 1981 to 1993.

It was still basically a Democratic seat, but you're still right in that had it been someone besides Jack Ryan, Obama very well could've been beaten.

Considering the President himself is a Trekker, there could be a whole different effect on him through this POD.

 

[phx1138]

You fail to realize the era Star Trek fan reaction of "this won't work" and "how dare you" that preceded and accompanied the first season or two

True. There were also undoubtedly fans, like myself, who were fans of "TOS" & were dreading a recast reboot (before the term existed), & ended up fair pleased. Tho, in my case, had there been no Patrick Stewart, IDK if I'd have watched past the pilot. (Especially with Gene's mania for Q...) OTOH, write out The Wesley & Data (or make Data a Vulcan), & at a minimum recast Beverly...

As for Jeri & the "Obama Effect", it's not like she had no prospect of getting anything else. Hollywood always has parts for pretty blondes, after all.