The Eternal Commonwealth: A surviving Polish- Lithuanian Commonwealth TL

[random_____guy]

Part 1: Prelude

The years 1385 and 1386 were crucial moments for the Kingdom of Poland and Grand Duchy of Lithuania. Poland was ruled by an underage queen while Lithuania was ruled by a recently converted Christian. With the conversion of Grand Duke Jogaila in 1345 came his marriage to Jadwiga of Poland as well as the Union of Krewo. While this did resolve the succession crisis of Poland, it did not help with foreign antagonism. The Teutonic Knights were still fervent in their attacks upon Lithuanian soil, and the nobles of both Lithuania and Poland were uneasy.
While Lithuania’s process of Christianization was underway with the help of the Polish church and Andrzej Jastrzębie, Jogaila was facing increased resistance to his rule in Lithuania. His cousin, Vytautas, aimed to become grand duke himself and began a civil war in 1389 with the support of Teutonic Grandmaster Konrad von Wallenrode. The two joined forces and began a siege of Vilnius, which was under the control of Skirgaila, Jogaila’s brother. While the siege continued, Jogaila (now Władysław II) assembled an army made of Poles, Lithuanians, and Ruthenians. He swiftly moved to support his brother and lift the siege on Vilnius, making it to the city just before the attackers managed to breakthrough. The ensuing Battle of Vilnius ended with Władysław’s victory and Vytautas being slain. The Teutonic Knights retreated to their land to lick their wounds and prepare for a future incursion into Lithuania. With this victory, Poland and Lithuania were formally in personal union under Władysław II.

Note: The POD is Jogalia managing to keep the throne from his cousin Vytautas, which allows him to later defeat the Teutonic Knights at Marienburg

 

[Wolttaire]

hmmm intresting

 

[Vinization]

Looks promising!

 

[Marc Anthony]

seems good

 

[krieger]

Part 1: Prelude

The years 1385 and 1386 were crucial moments for the Kingdom of Poland and Grand Duchy of Lithuania. Poland was ruled by an underage queen while Lithuania was ruled by a recently converted Christian. With the conversion of Grand Duke Jogaila in 1345 came his marriage to Jadwiga of Poland as well as the Union of Krewo. While this did resolve the succession crisis of Poland, it did not help with foreign antagonism. The Teutonic Knights were still fervent in their attacks upon Lithuanian soil, and the nobles of both Lithuania and Poland were uneasy.
While Lithuania’s process of Christianization was underway with the help of the Polish church and Andrzej Jastrzębie, Jogaila was facing increased resistance to his rule in Lithuania. His cousin, Vytautas, aimed to become grand duke himself and began a civil war in 1389 with the support of Teutonic Grandmaster Konrad von Wallenrode. The two joined forces and began a siege of Vilnius, which was under the control of Skirgaila, Jogaila’s brother. While the siege continued, Jogaila (now Władysław II) assembled an army made of Poles, Lithuanians, and Ruthenians. He swiftly moved to support his brother and lift the siege on Vilnius, making it to the city just before the attackers managed to breakthrough. The ensuing Battle of Vilnius ended with Władysław’s victory and Vytautas being slain. The Teutonic Knights retreated to their land to lick their wounds and prepare for a future incursion into Lithuania. With this victory, Poland and Lithuania were formally in personal union under Władysław II.

Note: The POD is Jogalia managing to keep the throne from his cousin Vytautas, which allows him to later defeat the Teutonic Knights at Marienburg

No, both in OTL and in case of total Jogaila's victory it won't be simple personal union. Union of Krewo explicitly stated, that Lithuania was meant to be incorporated to Poland an it wasn't some bumbling with no effect on real life - after Jogaila's coronation, Lithuanian duke paid homage both to him and to the Corona Regni Poloniae - so to Polish state itself. Vytautas managed to transform Lithuania in Polish fief - in Ostrów agreement, he pays homage to Corona Regni Poloniae and Hedwig d'Anjou and he states that his authority over Lithuania comes from appointment by king of Poland. If Jogaila won that war decisively, there won't be any "Commonwealth", because Grand Duchy of Lithuania would become a part of Kingdom of Poland.

 

[marcinL]

No, both in OTL and in case of total Jogaila's victory it won't be simple personal union. Union of Krewo explicitly stated, that Lithuania was meant to be incorporated to Poland an it wasn't some bumbling with no effect on real life - after Jogaila's coronation, Lithuanian duke paid homage both to him and to the Corona Regni Poloniae - so to Polish state itself. Vytautas managed to transform Lithuania in Polish fief - in Ostrów agreement, he pays homage to Corona Regni Poloniae and Hedwig d'Anjou and he states that his authority over Lithuania comes from appointment by king of Poland. If Jogaila won that war decisively, there won't be any "Commonwealth", because Grand Duchy of Lithuania would become a part of Kingdom of Poland.

So what? That something was written doesnt mean it must happen

 

[krieger]

So what? That something was written doesnt mean it must happen

So what? That something was written doesnt mean it must happen

Maybe it won't happen in full extent, but it'd be closer to it than OTL.

 

[marcinL]

Maybe it won't happen in full extent, but it'd be closer to it than OTL.

Yeah, but imo that part of Lithuania becoming part of Poland is like today electoral promises. Poles should count themselves lucky if they are allowed to settle in Volhynia and thereabouts

 

[UnaiB]

@Augenis

 

[Augenis]

@Augenis

Why

 

[random_____guy]

No, both in OTL and in case of total Jogaila's victory it won't be simple personal union. Union of Krewo explicitly stated, that Lithuania was meant to be incorporated to Poland an it wasn't some bumbling with no effect on real life - after Jogaila's coronation, Lithuanian duke paid homage both to him and to the Corona Regni Poloniae - so to Polish state itself. Vytautas managed to transform Lithuania in Polish fief - in Ostrów agreement, he pays homage to Corona Regni Poloniae and Hedwig d'Anjou and he states that his authority over Lithuania comes from appointment by king of Poland. If Jogaila won that war decisively, there won't be any "Commonwealth", because Grand Duchy of Lithuania would become a part of Kingdom of Poland.

If I remember correctly, the Union of Krewo was specifically vague and left a lot open for interpretation. There have always been several interpretations of the document, but I am going by the one where the two are only united by the monarch. As of now, Lithuania is neither a province nor fief of Poland, they are two sovereign nations united under Jogaila.

 

[UnaiB]

Why

Because this TL is about Lithuania.

 

[Augenis]

Because this TL is about Lithuania.

Don't ping me everywhere where Lithuania is mentioned...

 

[random_____guy]

The Prussian War

Following the Lithuanian civil war, Wladyslaw/ Jogaila was forced to prepare for another war against the Teutons. However, he got a moment of repose with the birth of his first son, Mirosław. Wladyslaw was extremely joyful and was glad to have had a son with his beloved wife. Unfortunately, his wife Jadwiga died during the birth and was later buried in Krakow on September 3rd, 1401. Wladyslaw greatly mourned her death, as did much of her former subjects. Wladyslaw vowed not to marry again and instead focused on raising his son as well as he could while also governing two nations. Wladyslaw continued to incorporate the two states together, much to the disdain of some nobles. In early 1409, the Teutonic Knights under Grandmaster Heinrich von Plauen began an invasion of both Poland and Lithuania. They were invited into western Lithuania by Svitrigalia, another claimant to the Lithuanian throne. Additionally, the Hungarians were about to attack the Poles from the south, but an attack from Murad II distracted Sigismund of Hungary from fulfilling his promises to the knights. Wladyslaw, Siemowit IV of Masovia and Alexander the Good of Moldavia were prepared for this inevitable conflict and prepared to go on the offensive immediately. Additionally, the Hohenzollerns of Brandenburg aided the Poles in their conflict in exchange for Neumark. Wladyslaw and Alexander’s strategy was to move to Marienburg and take it as soon as possible under one massive army. However, it did not take long for the Teutons to figure this out, and they soon moved to counter the Polish forces. The two armies met in the Battle of Olsztyn, where the 25,000 strong Polish- Lithuanian and Moldavian forces fought against the 18,000 strong Teutonic army. After brutal fighting throughout the afternoon of July 1st 1410, the Teutonic forces were routed. Forced into a difficult retreat to Marienburg, the Teutons began to set up desperate defences to ward off Wladyslaw. Only 5 days later, Wladyslaw marched on Marienburg, where von Plauen was unable to construct a solid defence. Marienburg fell, and so did other major cities such as Gdansk, Torun and Krolewiec. The Teutonic order had been crushed, and Wladyslaw was able to force a harsh peace. With both von Plauen and Svitrigalia dead, none were able to defend the Teutonic side of the treaty. The Livonian branch of the order would be left alone, but the entirety of Prussia was to be split between Poland and Lithuania, with Neumark going to Brandenburg.

 

[Vinization]

Will there be a map later on?

So now that the Teutonic Knights have been dealt with, what's next for Jogaila?

Russia? The Ottomans? Internal consolidation?

Also, good to see it's still alive!

 

[Zygmunt Stary]

wever, he got a moment of repose with the birth of his first son, Mirosław. Wladyslaw was extremely joyful and was glad to have had a son with his beloved wife. Unfortunately, his wife Jadwiga died during the birth and was later buried in Krakow on September 3rd, 1401. Wladyslaw greatly mourned her death, as did much of her former subjects. Wladyslaw vowed not to marry again and instead focused on raising his son as well as he could while also governing two nations.

Why Mirosław? This name seems so out of the place. Sure, it was common in Poland, but among peasantry and lesser nobility, not among royalty. From 966 to 1795 OTL no king, king's son, king's brother, king's cousin used that name. Most likely son of Jagiełło and Jadwiga would be Władysław after his father and St. Ladislaus I of Hungary (who was praised by court of Jadwiga's father Louis I of Poland and Hungary), less likely - Louis after his maternal grandfather, aforementioned Louis I of Hungary or Casimir (Kazimierz) after Casimir III the Great, or Andrew (Andrzej), Stefan (Stephen) or John (Jan) after Jadwiga's paternal uncles and cousin. Another possibilities are Bolesław, after uncle Svitrigaila (this was his baptism name) and Bolesław I the Bold/the Great (medieval Polish sources refer to him as Bolesław the Great) or Aleksander (after deceased Vytatuas and boy's great-grandfather, Alexander of Tver). And technically, the child is rigthful heir to throne of Hungary, Sigismund might have had problems with keeping his throne.

 

[marcinL]

IIRC that Von Plauen was a nobody who IOTL only become GM after the most of high ranking members was slain at Grunwald and in response to his successfl defense of the Order State, and later on he was anyway deposed by TK after he pissed off enough knights with his hardline politics.

 

[seraphim74]

Why Mirosław? This name seems so out of the place. [.....] And technically, the child is rigthful heir to throne of Hungary, Sigismund might have had problems with keeping his throne.

I agree. IMO either Casimir or Władysław (the OTL firtsborn of Władysław II was also named Władysław).
Sigismund of Hungary might be appeased to leave Poland alone in exchange for Jagiełło's son giving up his claims to Hungarian throne.


Originally posted by MarcinL

IRC that Von Plauen was a nobody who IOTL only become GM after the most of high ranking members was slain at Grunwald and in response to his successfl defense of the Order State, and later on he was anyway deposed by TK after he pissed off enough knights with his hardline politics.

Indeed. The very fact that he wasn't at Grunwald battle, unlike all top leaders of the Order, might be a sign of his relatively low position.

Originally posted by random___guy

SNIP

I'm a little surprised with Moldovian forces fighting at Olsztyn (Allenstein); it is a long way from Moldova to the Order State. Would they be able to join Polish-Lithuanian forces in time? Especially with the Ottomans on the move again, even if against Hungary?
And I'm not sure Brandenburg would be so willing to help the Poles. In exchange for Neumark? In 1402 Brandenburg pawned Neumark to the Teutonic Order, and they ruled it until 1455, I think, even after the OTL battle of Grunwald. Poland could not offer Neumark to the Brandenburg and even if Władysław offers it to the Hohenzollerns in a kind of partition of the Order State, the Order could easily outbid the Poles. Not to mention that: 1. The Order was rather popular in the HRE and fighting against them would be considered by many German knights as unworthy of a Christian ; 2. The Order was a military power, so joining a war against such a power would be risky; 3. OTL Brandenburg didn't seem so keen on getting Neumark back even after OTL battle of Grunwald; they got it back only around 1455.

 

[Zygmunt Stary]

I agree. IMO either Casimir or Władysław (the OTL firtsborn of Władysław II was also named Władysław).
Sigismund of Hungary might be appeased to leave Poland alone in exchange for Jagiełło's son giving up his claims to Hungarian throne.

The boy is half-Angevin, so I think names from Angevin pool (apart from Charles, which can be associated too much with Charles of Durazzo) are as probable as Casimir, so Louis (Ludwik), Andrew (Andrzej), Stephen (Stefan) or John (Jan). Last possibility is naming the boy Bolesław after Bolesław I the Bold and uncle Svitrigaila. I think if Jagiełło didn't use the opportunity to get himself crowned in 1401, than his son would probably give up the claims for Sigismund's lifetime and than fight for it after Sig's death.