Place names in a Greater Tang China

[varyar]

Hi all,

I'm considering commissioning a map in an ATL where China (however implausible it is thanks to logistics and a changing balance of power in the region) manages to hold on to the frontier territories it conquered in the 7th century, as here:

Some provincial and city names are rather obvious, but what about Tocharia and Antiochia? What might be more natural Chinese names for them? And what about the dividing Anbei and Annan into two (or more) provinces - two or three going east to west across Anbei and dividing Annan into a northern and southern province? Likewise for Andong, especially the parts that make up OTL Korea?

What do you, the readers at home, think?

 

[LeX]

Not sure how period-accurate these names are, but a quick look at Chinese Wikipedia gives me 安塔基雅 (An ta ji ya) for Antiochia and 吐火羅 (Tu huo luo) for Tocharia(ns). Korea might be divided between Andong and 新羅 (Xinluo), the Chinese reading of Silla, as Silla was the larger of the two southern Korean kingdoms and presumably had some cultural differences from the vanquished Goguryeo that could justify its separation from the rest of Korea/southern Manchuria. Don't know enough about the history or cultural geography of Vietnam to comment on that.

 

[varyar]

Not sure how period-accurate these names are, but a quick look at Chinese Wikipedia gives me 安塔基雅 (An ta ji ya) for Antiochia and 吐火羅 (Tu huo luo) for Tocharia(ns). Korea might be divided between Andong and 新羅 (Xinluo), the Chinese reading of Silla, as Silla was the larger of the two southern Korean kingdoms and presumably had some cultural differences from the vanquished Goguryeo that could justify its separation from the rest of Korea/southern Manchuria. Don't know enough about the history or cultural geography of Vietnam to comment on that.

Cool, that's a good start. Thank you!

 

[MisterP]

also note that the Chinese "transcriptions" of non-Han exonyms are in Middle Chinese, which is quite different from present-day Mandarin

 

[varyar]

also note that the Chinese "transcriptions" of non-Han exonyms are in Middle Chinese, which is quite different from present-day Mandarin

Good point. I think for simplicity's sake using the modern form of the language is the best bet, though.

 

[Admiral Fischer]

In more formal language Silla was also styled as 乐浪 (Lelang) or 鸡林 (Jilin) referring the Silla monarchs' official Chinese title within the Sinocentric system.

 

[Diocles]

There are some mistakes in this picture. Fields that belong to today's Yunnan Province has never been under the jurisdiction of Annan Protectorate, and soon became independent as Nanzhao in the mid Tang. Back to Annan, basically the most commonly used name to refer the Red River Plain is Jiaozhi/交趾. The province established after the Ming Dynasty conquered Vietnam also used this name.

 

[Diocles]

but a quick look at Chinese Wikipedia gives me 安塔基雅 (An ta ji ya) for Antiochia

Antajiya/安塔基雅 is a modern Chinese translation from the Turkish name Antakya. Ancient Chinese historical records do not seem to mention Antioch. One name Tiaozhi/条支 refers the Seleucid Empire might be the translation of Antiochia, but also someone claims it was from Seleucia.