There will be 600-ish MPs eventually, but it takes a bloody long time to work this all out (and write a dissertation at the same time).
List alternate PMs or Presidents
- Thread starter Razors are for Fish
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There will be 600-ish MPs eventually, but it takes a bloody long time to work this all out (and write a dissertation at the same time).
The Bourbon Democrats were to the right of most conservative Republicans at that time by modern standards.Progressive in TTL is in between Democrats and Republicansso a liberal Republican and conservative Democrat is the same.
Oh I seeeeeeeee! Sorry I thought this was the end product so couldn't work out the massive loss of MPs.
I was hoping for Tzaero to carry on the age of John TL, but as he has not I thought I would
My knowledge of things pre-1900 aint that great.
You did good mate.
One of the top scoring links on Reddit today was that fun anecdote about how Thomas Jefferson wanted a new constitution every twenty years or so. I was bored, so I whipped up an admittedly ASB list that did just that. I have a few footnotes, but I'd like to remind everyone that this is explicitly unserious (as you'll see in the later lists ) so don't get too bent out of shape about it.
List of Presidents of the United States during the Second Republic (1787-1812)(1)
1. George Washington (Independent-Virginia) 1789-97
2. John Adams (Federalist-Massachusetts) 1797-1801
3. Thomas Jefferson (Republican-Virginia) 1801-09
4. James Madison (R-Virginia) 1809-12
List of Presidents of the United States during the Third Republic (1812-37)(2)
1. James Madison (R-Virginia) 1812-16
2. James Monroe (R-Virginia) 1816-24
3. John Q. Adams (R-Massachusetts) 1824-28
4. Andrew Jackson (Democratic-Tennessee) 1828-36
5. Martin Van Buren (D-New York) 1836-37
List of Presidents of the United States during the Fourth Republic (1837-62)(3)
1. Martin Van Buren (D-New York) 1837-41
2. William Henry Harrison (Whig-Ohio) 1841(4)
John Tyler (Whig, then Independent-Virginia) 1841-43 (Acting)
3. James K. Polk (D-Tennessee) 1843-47
4. Zachary Taylor (W-Louisiana) 1847-50(5)
Millard Fillmore (W-New York) 1850-51 (Acting)
5. Franklin Pierce (D-New Hampshire) 1851-55
6. James Buchanan (D-Pennsylvania) 1855-59
7. Abraham Lincoln (Republican-Illinois) 1859-62
List of Presidents of the United States under the Fifth Republic (1862-87)(6)
1. Abraham Lincoln (R-Illinois) 1862-63(7)
Andrew Johnson (D-Tennessee) 1863-64 (Acting)
2. Ulysses S. Grant (R-Illinois) 1864-72
3. Samuel J. Tilden (D-New York) 1872-76
4. James A. Garfield (R-Ohio) 1876(8)
Chester A. Arthur (R-New York) 1876 (Acting)
5. Samuel J. Tilden (D-New York) 1876-80
6. James G. Blaine (R-Maine) 1880-84
7. S. Grover Cleveland (D-New York) 1884-87
List of Presidents of the United States under the Sixth Republic (1887-1912)(9)
1. Benjamin Harrison (R-Indiana) 1887-1891(10)
Levi P. Morton (R-New York) 1891-92 (Acting)
2. Levi P. Morton (R-New York) 1892-98
3. William McKinley (R-Ohio) 1898-1904
4. Alton Parker (D-New York) 1904-10
5. William Howard Taft (R-Ohio) 1910-12
List of Presidents of the United States under the Seventh Republic (1912-37)(11)
1. Theodore Roosevelt (R-New York) 1912-18
2. Warren G. Harding (R-Ohio) 1918-24
3. William G. McAdoo (D-California) 1924-30
4. Newton Baker (D-Ohio) 1930-36
5. John L. Lewis (Labor-Pennsylvania) 1936-37
List of First Secretaries of the United States under the Seventh Republic (1912-37)
1. James Mann (R-Illinois) 1912-16
2. Frederick Gillett (R-Massachusetts) 1916-22
3. Finis Garrett (D-Tennessee) 1922-29
4. John Nance Garner (D-Texas) 1929-32
5. Paul J. Kvale (Labor-Minnesota) 1932-34
6. Jo Byrns (D-Tennessee) 1934-36
7. Paul J. Kvale (L-Minnesota) 1936-37
List of Presidents of the United States under the Eighth Republic (1937-62)(12)
1. Smedley Butler (Independent-Pennsylvania) 1937-40(13)
William B. Bankhead (D-Tennessee) 1940 (Acting)(14)
Sam Rayburn (D-Texas) 1940 (Acting)
2. Joseph P. Kennedy (D-Massachusetts) 1940-46
3. Paul Robeson (L-New Jersey) 1946-52
4. Frank Sinatra (L-New Jersey) 1952-58
5. Marion M. Morrison (R-Iowa) 1958-62
List of First Secretaries of the United States under the Eighth Republic (1937-62)
1. Paul J. Kvale (L-Minnesota) 1937
2. William B. Bankhead (D-Tennessee) 1937-40(14)
3. Sam Rayburn (D-Texas) 1940-46
4. Vito Marcantonio (L-New York) 1946-52(15)
5. Hubert Humphrey (L-Minnesota) 1952-54
6. Sam Rayburn (D-Texas) 1954-60
7. Malcolm Little (L-Platte) 1960-62
List of Presidents of the United States under the Ninth Republic (1962-87)(16)
1. Edward R. Murrow (I-New York) 1962-65(17)
Malcolm Little (L-Platte) 1965-66 (Acting)
2. John F. Kennedy (I-Massachusetts) 1966-72(18)
3. John R. Cash (I-Tennessee) 1972-78(19)
4. Fr. Robert F. Kennedy (I-New York) 1978-84(20)
5. Ronald Reagan (I-California) 1984-87(21)
List of First Secretaries of the United States under the Ninth Republic (1962-87)
1. Malcolm Little (L-Platte) 1962-68
2. Tony Mazzocchi (L-New York) 1968-72
3. John V. Lindsay (D-New York) 1972-80
4. Angela Davis (L-Alabama) 1980-87
List of First Secretaries of the United States under the Tenth Republic (1987-2012)(22)
1. Angela Davis (L-Alabama) 1987-88
2. Avro Halberg (Communist-Minnesota) 1988-94
3. Bert Sinatra (C-New Jersey) 1994-2002(23)
4. George Paul (L-Kentucky) 2002-06(24)
5. Lesane P. Crooks (C-California) 2006-10
6. John F. Cena (L-Florida) 2010-12
List of Premiers of the United Workers' and Farmers' Council Republics of America (2012-)(25)
1. John F. Cena (L-Florida) 2012-18
2. Taylor Swift (C-Pennsylvania) 2018-
Footnotes:
1 The 'First Republic' refers to the United States under the Articles of Confederation.
2 The Constitution of 1812 would retain most of the features of the Constitution of 1787, although it also made a few crucial modifications to the workings of government. Drawn up by a Republican majority in the constitutional convention, it explicitly barred the Supreme Court from utilizing 'judicial review', mandated the election of the President and Vice President on a single ticket, banned the international slave trade, ended lifetime tenure for members of the Supreme Court, and gave the states the ability to nullify federal law if 2/3rds of the states concurred.
3 The Constitution of 1837 would be a major democratic advance in some areas, but an outright retrogression in others. For starters, citizenship would now be constitutionally limited to whites only, a definite retrogression. But on the flipside, universal white male suffrage was ensured at age 21, and all property restrictions on voting and holding office were definitively wiped out. The controversial nullification provision of the 1812 Constitution was removed after some wrangling. The President would now be elected by popular vote, as well. Slavery was explicitly protected in areas where it already existed.
4 Died in office. As per the Constitution of 1837, Vice President John Tyler became Acting President and a new election was scheduled to fill the vacancy in 1842.
5 Died in office.
6 The Constitution of 1862 was the greatest single advance for democracy in the United States up to that point. Suffrage was according to all men over 21, regardless of race, and all persons, regardless of color or race, were declared citizens. Slavery was explicitly prohibited, and the federal government empowered to raise an income tax for the first time.
7 Assassinated.
8 Assassinated.
9 The Constitution of 1887 held the line on most of the democratic advances of 1837 and 1862. The President was limited to a single, six year term as a result of this constitution, and the federal government was explicitly given the power to regulate commerce. Civil service reforms were also enshrined into the U.S. Constitution.
10 Assassinated.
11 The Constitution of 1912 saw another democratic advance. The Presidency was weakened and forced into a power-sharing agreement with the House, which henceforth gained control of the cabinet and would be headed by a 'First Secretary', modeled on the British Prime Minister. The Presidential veto was done away with and transferred to the Senate, but modified so as to be a suspensive veto, unless all members of the Senate concurred, in which case a piece of legislation could be vetoed outright. Initiatives, referendums, and recall were implemented at the federal level as well.
12 The Constitution of 1937 reflected the growing strength of organized labor and the democratic struggle ongoing in the United States. The Presidency was stripped of virtually all its powers, the position of Vice President abolished (in the event of a presidential death, the First Secretary would serve as acting President), and the power to elect the President transferred from the public to both the House and Senate, provided they could agree to elect a person with a 2/3rds vote in each, effectively rendering the spot a ceremonial one for noncontroversial figures who could act as 'promoter-in-chief' of the nation abroad and for foreign dignitaries. The House was also empowered to override Senatorial absolute vetoes, which were weakened. A referendum was required for any use of military force, and in the House, state districts were replaced with statewide at-large elections for all representatives. Lifetime tenure on the Supreme Court was replaced with a single term of 12 years, and all lower level judges were made electable.
13 Died in office.
14 Died in office.
15 Deposed in an intra-party coup. Marcantonio was viewed by many within the Labor Party as being 'too close to Paris' (the center of the European Federation of Workers' and Farmers' Council Republics, or EFWFCR) and was replaced by center-right Laborite Hubert Humphrey, a change that was also reflected in the election of Frank Sinatra to the Presidency.
16 The Ninth Republic would represent another great democratic advance. The Presidency was made officially nonpartisan, while the Senate was abolished and the House given its powers. The Supreme Court was opened up to election, and the rights of sexual and racial minorities were given greater protections under the law.
17 Died in office.
18 An investigative journalist whose nomination for President nonetheless sparked controversy owing to his being the son of a previous President.
19 In a surprising move, the Democratic-controlled Congress nominated noted conservative Laborite and folksinger John Cash for President in an attempt to win back sections of the working class it had lost over the past decade to the growing Labor Party.
20 Controversial in part because he was a Kennedy and in part because he was a sitting Roman Catholic priest.
21 The nomination of a prominent member of the Communist Party and beloved actor for the Presidency would spark heated debate when former Communist Angela Davis announced Reagan as her pick for President in 1984.
22 The Constitution of 1987 abolished the Presidency, reduced the term of judges from 12 years to six, and introduced proportional representation in the House of Representatives, which was renamed the National Assembly. It likewise created 'citizen oversight councils' with the ability to monitor bureaucracies, hold politicians to account, and veto legislation.
23 Fictional person. Albert 'Bert' Sinatra is the child of former President Frank Sinatra and former First Lady Billie Holiday Sinatra.
24 George Paul, noted libertarian socialist, is the son of former Labor Party Congressman Ron Paul, also a noted libertarian socialist. He's named after Henry George.
25 With a historic agreement between Labor Party leader John Cena and Communist leader Dwayne "The Boulder" Johnson, the constitutional convention of 2012 voted unanimously to transfer all organs of state power to workers' and farmers' councils, which had gradually absorbed more state power over the years since the rise to prominence of the Labor and Communist parties. While there was some resistance to this from members of the capitalist class, said resistance was more or less dealt with when the Communist and Labor party paramilitaries (dubbed 'the People's Champions' by Johnson) intervened to ensure a swift transfer of power to the councils.
) so don't get too bent out of shape about it.List of Presidents of the United States during the Second Republic (1787-1812)(1)
1. George Washington (Independent-Virginia) 1789-97
2. John Adams (Federalist-Massachusetts) 1797-1801
3. Thomas Jefferson (Republican-Virginia) 1801-09
4. James Madison (R-Virginia) 1809-12
List of Presidents of the United States during the Third Republic (1812-37)(2)
1. James Madison (R-Virginia) 1812-16
2. James Monroe (R-Virginia) 1816-24
3. John Q. Adams (R-Massachusetts) 1824-28
4. Andrew Jackson (Democratic-Tennessee) 1828-36
5. Martin Van Buren (D-New York) 1836-37
List of Presidents of the United States during the Fourth Republic (1837-62)(3)
1. Martin Van Buren (D-New York) 1837-41
2. William Henry Harrison (Whig-Ohio) 1841(4)
John Tyler (Whig, then Independent-Virginia) 1841-43 (Acting)
3. James K. Polk (D-Tennessee) 1843-47
4. Zachary Taylor (W-Louisiana) 1847-50(5)
Millard Fillmore (W-New York) 1850-51 (Acting)
5. Franklin Pierce (D-New Hampshire) 1851-55
6. James Buchanan (D-Pennsylvania) 1855-59
7. Abraham Lincoln (Republican-Illinois) 1859-62
List of Presidents of the United States under the Fifth Republic (1862-87)(6)
1. Abraham Lincoln (R-Illinois) 1862-63(7)
Andrew Johnson (D-Tennessee) 1863-64 (Acting)
2. Ulysses S. Grant (R-Illinois) 1864-72
3. Samuel J. Tilden (D-New York) 1872-76
4. James A. Garfield (R-Ohio) 1876(8)
Chester A. Arthur (R-New York) 1876 (Acting)
5. Samuel J. Tilden (D-New York) 1876-80
6. James G. Blaine (R-Maine) 1880-84
7. S. Grover Cleveland (D-New York) 1884-87
List of Presidents of the United States under the Sixth Republic (1887-1912)(9)
1. Benjamin Harrison (R-Indiana) 1887-1891(10)
Levi P. Morton (R-New York) 1891-92 (Acting)
2. Levi P. Morton (R-New York) 1892-98
3. William McKinley (R-Ohio) 1898-1904
4. Alton Parker (D-New York) 1904-10
5. William Howard Taft (R-Ohio) 1910-12
List of Presidents of the United States under the Seventh Republic (1912-37)(11)
1. Theodore Roosevelt (R-New York) 1912-18
2. Warren G. Harding (R-Ohio) 1918-24
3. William G. McAdoo (D-California) 1924-30
4. Newton Baker (D-Ohio) 1930-36
5. John L. Lewis (Labor-Pennsylvania) 1936-37
List of First Secretaries of the United States under the Seventh Republic (1912-37)
1. James Mann (R-Illinois) 1912-16
2. Frederick Gillett (R-Massachusetts) 1916-22
3. Finis Garrett (D-Tennessee) 1922-29
4. John Nance Garner (D-Texas) 1929-32
5. Paul J. Kvale (Labor-Minnesota) 1932-34
6. Jo Byrns (D-Tennessee) 1934-36
7. Paul J. Kvale (L-Minnesota) 1936-37
List of Presidents of the United States under the Eighth Republic (1937-62)(12)
1. Smedley Butler (Independent-Pennsylvania) 1937-40(13)
William B. Bankhead (D-Tennessee) 1940 (Acting)(14)
Sam Rayburn (D-Texas) 1940 (Acting)
2. Joseph P. Kennedy (D-Massachusetts) 1940-46
3. Paul Robeson (L-New Jersey) 1946-52
4. Frank Sinatra (L-New Jersey) 1952-58
5. Marion M. Morrison (R-Iowa) 1958-62
List of First Secretaries of the United States under the Eighth Republic (1937-62)
1. Paul J. Kvale (L-Minnesota) 1937
2. William B. Bankhead (D-Tennessee) 1937-40(14)
3. Sam Rayburn (D-Texas) 1940-46
4. Vito Marcantonio (L-New York) 1946-52(15)
5. Hubert Humphrey (L-Minnesota) 1952-54
6. Sam Rayburn (D-Texas) 1954-60
7. Malcolm Little (L-Platte) 1960-62
List of Presidents of the United States under the Ninth Republic (1962-87)(16)
1. Edward R. Murrow (I-New York) 1962-65(17)
Malcolm Little (L-Platte) 1965-66 (Acting)
2. John F. Kennedy (I-Massachusetts) 1966-72(18)
3. John R. Cash (I-Tennessee) 1972-78(19)
4. Fr. Robert F. Kennedy (I-New York) 1978-84(20)
5. Ronald Reagan (I-California) 1984-87(21)
List of First Secretaries of the United States under the Ninth Republic (1962-87)
1. Malcolm Little (L-Platte) 1962-68
2. Tony Mazzocchi (L-New York) 1968-72
3. John V. Lindsay (D-New York) 1972-80
4. Angela Davis (L-Alabama) 1980-87
List of First Secretaries of the United States under the Tenth Republic (1987-2012)(22)
1. Angela Davis (L-Alabama) 1987-88
2. Avro Halberg (Communist-Minnesota) 1988-94
3. Bert Sinatra (C-New Jersey) 1994-2002(23)
4. George Paul (L-Kentucky) 2002-06(24)
5. Lesane P. Crooks (C-California) 2006-10
6. John F. Cena (L-Florida) 2010-12
List of Premiers of the United Workers' and Farmers' Council Republics of America (2012-)(25)
1. John F. Cena (L-Florida) 2012-18
2. Taylor Swift (C-Pennsylvania) 2018-
Footnotes:
1 The 'First Republic' refers to the United States under the Articles of Confederation.
2 The Constitution of 1812 would retain most of the features of the Constitution of 1787, although it also made a few crucial modifications to the workings of government. Drawn up by a Republican majority in the constitutional convention, it explicitly barred the Supreme Court from utilizing 'judicial review', mandated the election of the President and Vice President on a single ticket, banned the international slave trade, ended lifetime tenure for members of the Supreme Court, and gave the states the ability to nullify federal law if 2/3rds of the states concurred.
3 The Constitution of 1837 would be a major democratic advance in some areas, but an outright retrogression in others. For starters, citizenship would now be constitutionally limited to whites only, a definite retrogression. But on the flipside, universal white male suffrage was ensured at age 21, and all property restrictions on voting and holding office were definitively wiped out. The controversial nullification provision of the 1812 Constitution was removed after some wrangling. The President would now be elected by popular vote, as well. Slavery was explicitly protected in areas where it already existed.
4 Died in office. As per the Constitution of 1837, Vice President John Tyler became Acting President and a new election was scheduled to fill the vacancy in 1842.
5 Died in office.
6 The Constitution of 1862 was the greatest single advance for democracy in the United States up to that point. Suffrage was according to all men over 21, regardless of race, and all persons, regardless of color or race, were declared citizens. Slavery was explicitly prohibited, and the federal government empowered to raise an income tax for the first time.
7 Assassinated.
8 Assassinated.
9 The Constitution of 1887 held the line on most of the democratic advances of 1837 and 1862. The President was limited to a single, six year term as a result of this constitution, and the federal government was explicitly given the power to regulate commerce. Civil service reforms were also enshrined into the U.S. Constitution.
10 Assassinated.
11 The Constitution of 1912 saw another democratic advance. The Presidency was weakened and forced into a power-sharing agreement with the House, which henceforth gained control of the cabinet and would be headed by a 'First Secretary', modeled on the British Prime Minister. The Presidential veto was done away with and transferred to the Senate, but modified so as to be a suspensive veto, unless all members of the Senate concurred, in which case a piece of legislation could be vetoed outright. Initiatives, referendums, and recall were implemented at the federal level as well.
12 The Constitution of 1937 reflected the growing strength of organized labor and the democratic struggle ongoing in the United States. The Presidency was stripped of virtually all its powers, the position of Vice President abolished (in the event of a presidential death, the First Secretary would serve as acting President), and the power to elect the President transferred from the public to both the House and Senate, provided they could agree to elect a person with a 2/3rds vote in each, effectively rendering the spot a ceremonial one for noncontroversial figures who could act as 'promoter-in-chief' of the nation abroad and for foreign dignitaries. The House was also empowered to override Senatorial absolute vetoes, which were weakened. A referendum was required for any use of military force, and in the House, state districts were replaced with statewide at-large elections for all representatives. Lifetime tenure on the Supreme Court was replaced with a single term of 12 years, and all lower level judges were made electable.
13 Died in office.
14 Died in office.
15 Deposed in an intra-party coup. Marcantonio was viewed by many within the Labor Party as being 'too close to Paris' (the center of the European Federation of Workers' and Farmers' Council Republics, or EFWFCR) and was replaced by center-right Laborite Hubert Humphrey, a change that was also reflected in the election of Frank Sinatra to the Presidency.
16 The Ninth Republic would represent another great democratic advance. The Presidency was made officially nonpartisan, while the Senate was abolished and the House given its powers. The Supreme Court was opened up to election, and the rights of sexual and racial minorities were given greater protections under the law.
17 Died in office.
18 An investigative journalist whose nomination for President nonetheless sparked controversy owing to his being the son of a previous President.
19 In a surprising move, the Democratic-controlled Congress nominated noted conservative Laborite and folksinger John Cash for President in an attempt to win back sections of the working class it had lost over the past decade to the growing Labor Party.
20 Controversial in part because he was a Kennedy and in part because he was a sitting Roman Catholic priest.
21 The nomination of a prominent member of the Communist Party and beloved actor for the Presidency would spark heated debate when former Communist Angela Davis announced Reagan as her pick for President in 1984.
22 The Constitution of 1987 abolished the Presidency, reduced the term of judges from 12 years to six, and introduced proportional representation in the House of Representatives, which was renamed the National Assembly. It likewise created 'citizen oversight councils' with the ability to monitor bureaucracies, hold politicians to account, and veto legislation.
23 Fictional person. Albert 'Bert' Sinatra is the child of former President Frank Sinatra and former First Lady Billie Holiday Sinatra.
24 George Paul, noted libertarian socialist, is the son of former Labor Party Congressman Ron Paul, also a noted libertarian socialist. He's named after Henry George.
25 With a historic agreement between Labor Party leader John Cena and Communist leader Dwayne "The Boulder" Johnson, the constitutional convention of 2012 voted unanimously to transfer all organs of state power to workers' and farmers' councils, which had gradually absorbed more state power over the years since the rise to prominence of the Labor and Communist parties. While there was some resistance to this from members of the capitalist class, said resistance was more or less dealt with when the Communist and Labor party paramilitaries (dubbed 'the People's Champions' by Johnson) intervened to ensure a swift transfer of power to the councils.
So in the same vein of humility as others in this thread, I decided to redo my earliest list here. The one that didn't really have first names in it . It was fairly bad but this should be better.
Clay+Jackson=No Corrupt Bargain?
1825-1829:Andrew Jackson/John C. Calhoun[1]
1824:Henry Clay/Nathan Sanford, John Quincy Adams/John C. Calhoun, William Crawford/Nathaniel Macon
1829-1833:Andrew Jackson/William R. D. King
1828: John Q. Adams/James Barbour[2]
1833-1835:Daniel Webster/Robert Y Hayne
1832:Henry Clay/William R. D. King John C. Calhoun/Samuel Ingham[3]
1835-1837:Robert Y. Hayne/Vacant[4]
1837-1845:Roger B. Taney/Richard Mentor Johnson
1836:Robert Y. Hayne/Francis Granger
1840:William H. Harrison/John Berrien
1845-1845:Kenneth L. Anderson/John W. Davis
1844:David Crockett/various[5]
1845-1849:John W. Davis/Vacant
1849-1853:Robert Patterson/John White[6]
1848:John W. Davis/Andrew J. Donelson
1853-1861:William Trousdale/Jesse Bright
1852:Daniel Clark/William A. Graham[7]
1856:John Van Buren/Abraham Lincoln[8]
1856:Linn Boyd/John C. Freemon[9]
[1]Clay goes for Jackson as the POD. Jackson wins and everyone’s happy. Except for Adams and Crawford, who are pissed.
[2]The Adamites and Crawfordites get together to do something about it. They form the States Rights Republican Party, an uneasy coalition of northern and southern nullifiers that is unable to defeat the widely popular President Jackson.
[3]Unfortunately, when it comes to naming a successor, Jackson is unable to choose between Clay and Calhoun, and the Jacksonian Democrats splits in two. Webster and the S-R Republicans. Rise up the middle.
[4]Richard Lawrence’s assassination of Webster leads to a constitutional crisis; Hayne however manages to defy the critics who think he should be acting president. That and rabid pro-slavery rhetoric isn’t enough to get him re-elected, however. The Democratic compromise candidate, a protege of Jackson, easily wins.
[5]The Republican Party is going through it’s wilderness years. With Taney having started the Mexican-American War only months before the election, they struggle to be seen as loyal opposition. Accordingly, expansionist Sen. Crockett, with his cries of “Remember the Nueces”, makes the Republicans even more hawkish than the Democrats.
[6]Popular war hero Patterson brings the Republicans out of the wilderness, especially after Davis’ bungling means that the U.S. doesn’t gain any territory from the war. Despite being well-liked, the southern base of the party throws Patterson over in favor of a more friendly candidate in 1852.
[7]The outsider Democrats take up an anti-slavery plank, following former Pres. Davis’ lead in refusing to acquire any potentially slave-owning territory.
[8] And in 1856 Prince John finally wins on such a platform. What happens then? President Trousdale (unconstitutionally) declares the election illegitimate and uses southern militia to seize the capitol. Mayhem has just broken loose.
[9]Famous general Freemon from South Carolina is of course wholly in favor of slavery. Why else would he be put in command of President Trousdale’s new Army of the Ohio?
--------
Also a question - in memory of the departed Shaved Tuna, what would people think of some kind of List of the Fortnight challenge thread?
. It was fairly bad but this should be better.Clay+Jackson=No Corrupt Bargain?
1825-1829:Andrew Jackson/John C. Calhoun[1]
1824:Henry Clay/Nathan Sanford, John Quincy Adams/John C. Calhoun, William Crawford/Nathaniel Macon
1829-1833:Andrew Jackson/William R. D. King
1828: John Q. Adams/James Barbour[2]
1833-1835:Daniel Webster/Robert Y Hayne
1832:Henry Clay/William R. D. King John C. Calhoun/Samuel Ingham[3]
1835-1837:Robert Y. Hayne/Vacant[4]
1837-1845:Roger B. Taney/Richard Mentor Johnson
1836:Robert Y. Hayne/Francis Granger
1840:William H. Harrison/John Berrien
1845-1845:Kenneth L. Anderson/John W. Davis
1844:David Crockett/various[5]
1845-1849:John W. Davis/Vacant
1849-1853:Robert Patterson/John White[6]
1848:John W. Davis/Andrew J. Donelson
1853-1861:William Trousdale/Jesse Bright
1852:Daniel Clark/William A. Graham[7]
1856:John Van Buren/Abraham Lincoln[8]
1856:Linn Boyd/John C. Freemon[9]
[1]Clay goes for Jackson as the POD. Jackson wins and everyone’s happy. Except for Adams and Crawford, who are pissed.
[2]The Adamites and Crawfordites get together to do something about it. They form the States Rights Republican Party, an uneasy coalition of northern and southern nullifiers that is unable to defeat the widely popular President Jackson.
[3]Unfortunately, when it comes to naming a successor, Jackson is unable to choose between Clay and Calhoun, and the Jacksonian Democrats splits in two. Webster and the S-R Republicans. Rise up the middle.
[4]Richard Lawrence’s assassination of Webster leads to a constitutional crisis; Hayne however manages to defy the critics who think he should be acting president. That and rabid pro-slavery rhetoric isn’t enough to get him re-elected, however. The Democratic compromise candidate, a protege of Jackson, easily wins.
[5]The Republican Party is going through it’s wilderness years. With Taney having started the Mexican-American War only months before the election, they struggle to be seen as loyal opposition. Accordingly, expansionist Sen. Crockett, with his cries of “Remember the Nueces”, makes the Republicans even more hawkish than the Democrats.
[6]Popular war hero Patterson brings the Republicans out of the wilderness, especially after Davis’ bungling means that the U.S. doesn’t gain any territory from the war. Despite being well-liked, the southern base of the party throws Patterson over in favor of a more friendly candidate in 1852.
[7]The outsider Democrats take up an anti-slavery plank, following former Pres. Davis’ lead in refusing to acquire any potentially slave-owning territory.
[8] And in 1856 Prince John finally wins on such a platform. What happens then? President Trousdale (unconstitutionally) declares the election illegitimate and uses southern militia to seize the capitol. Mayhem has just broken loose.
[9]Famous general Freemon from South Carolina is of course wholly in favor of slavery. Why else would he be put in command of President Trousdale’s new Army of the Ohio?
--------
Also a question - in memory of the departed Shaved Tuna, what would people think of some kind of List of the Fortnight challenge thread?
My attempt at a "rotation system" where the PMs are supposed to be English-Scottish-Welsh-(N)Irish-English in that order.
Starting with Salisbury and Balfour. Not intended to be 100% realistic, BTW. I can see Fitt's ministry being very controversial.
Robert Gascoyne-Cecil, 3rd Marquess of Salisbury (Conservative) (English) 1895-1902
Arthur Balfour (Conservative) (Scottish) 1902-1906
David Lloyd George (Liberal) (Welsh) 1906-1910
Edward Carson (Conservative) (NIrish) 1910-1923
H. H. Asquith (Liberal) (English) 1923-1928*
Robert Munro (Liberal) (Scottish) 1928-1931
Frederick Llewellyn-Jones (Liberal National) (Welsh) 1931-1937
William Stewart (Unionist) (NIrish) 1937-1945
Clement Attlee (Labour) (English) 1945-1951
Alec Douglas-Home (Unionist) (Scottish) 1951-1962
Gwilym Lloyd George (Conservative) (Welsh) 1962-1965
Tom Boyd (NI Labour) (NIrish) 1965-1970
Edward Heath (Conservative) (English) 1970-1976
Teddy Taylor (Conservative) (Scottish) 1976-1979
John Prescott (Labour) (Welsh) 1979-1992
Gerry Fitt (NI Labour) (NIrish) 1992-1994
John Major (Conservative) (English) 1994-2002
David Mundell (Conservative) (Scottish) 2002-2009
Huw Lewis (Labour) (Welsh) 2009-present
Starting with Salisbury and Balfour. Not intended to be 100% realistic, BTW. I can see Fitt's ministry being very controversial.
Robert Gascoyne-Cecil, 3rd Marquess of Salisbury (Conservative) (English) 1895-1902
Arthur Balfour (Conservative) (Scottish) 1902-1906
David Lloyd George (Liberal) (Welsh) 1906-1910
Edward Carson (Conservative) (NIrish) 1910-1923
H. H. Asquith (Liberal) (English) 1923-1928*
Robert Munro (Liberal) (Scottish) 1928-1931
Frederick Llewellyn-Jones (Liberal National) (Welsh) 1931-1937
William Stewart (Unionist) (NIrish) 1937-1945
Clement Attlee (Labour) (English) 1945-1951
Alec Douglas-Home (Unionist) (Scottish) 1951-1962
Gwilym Lloyd George (Conservative) (Welsh) 1962-1965
Tom Boyd (NI Labour) (NIrish) 1965-1970
Edward Heath (Conservative) (English) 1970-1976
Teddy Taylor (Conservative) (Scottish) 1976-1979
John Prescott (Labour) (Welsh) 1979-1992
Gerry Fitt (NI Labour) (NIrish) 1992-1994
John Major (Conservative) (English) 1994-2002
David Mundell (Conservative) (Scottish) 2002-2009
Huw Lewis (Labour) (Welsh) 2009-present
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You do know he was born and raised in Plymouth and spent most of his life there or in London, right?
Yes. I know that. But he was of Welsh descent so I thought I could plausibly fit him there.
On second thoughts, I could easily replace him with Neil Kinnock. But it's quite clichey. Hmm... I could go for John Prescott. That could work.
As I see it, the most likely qualifier isn't that the person should identify with their respective nation - it's probably either birth or the location of the constituency they represent. As such, someone like Callaghan, an Englishman who represented a Cardiff seat, may or may not still qualify as Welsh for the purposes of representation.
CannedTech
Banned
One of the top scoring links on Reddit today was that fun anecdote about how Thomas Jefferson wanted a new constitution every twenty years or so. I was bored, so I whipped up an admittedly ASB list that did just that. I have a few footnotes, but I'd like to remind everyone that this is explicitly unserious (as you'll see in the later lists
List of Presidents of the United States during the Second Republic (1787-1812)(1)
I like it, especially presidents Davis, Crooks, and Little.
True. I'll go with Prescott because that's less "been there, done that" than Callaghan or Kinnock.
clintonforever
Banned
clintonforever[B said:
Other than the USAF including USAF technicians who could be bribed by the CIA, who would really be in a position to sabotage Air Force One?
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