If you could change One event post 1900..?

I'm not sure if it counts as 1 change, but I'd have the revolutionary communist wave in Europe post ww1 be a bigger success. That implies Reds winning Finnish civil war, Hungarian Soviet Republic surviving, Biennio Rosso turning into a succesful communist revolution in Italy, and Spartacist revolutoin succeeding in Germany (plus whatever domino effect these successes may have elsewhere!)

No fascist Italy or Nazi Germany, and capitalism on its knees in the 1920s! Plus the communists get actually industrial Germany to work! With the massive success they had with illiterate peasant Russia, imagine the wonders they could achieve with industrial Germany. Truly the biggest wasted opportunity of the century.

If this doesn't count as a single event, then I'd pick avoid the USSR collapse, or avoid the Sino-Soviet split (honestly, probably having someone else instead of Khruschev succeed Stalin might guarantee both of these results!)
 
Keep the Bolsheviks from establishing one party rule, and have the USSR remain a democratic multiparty left-wing democracy. And have them participate in the Paris Peace Conferences.

This avoids a hell of a lot of misery in the world- for starters, no Holodomor. Hitler's rise is also probsbly affected; the German Left was told to spurn the center by Stalin, who wanted to avoided Germany allowing itself with France & Britain. And a less belligerent (Trotsky etc.) And more integrated USSR means Hitler doesn't get off the ground even if he does rise to power- no appeasement at Munich, ni Molotov Ribbentrop pact, or at worst a better response to Barbarossa.
IIRC, the Soviets initially held elections, but after the moderate Social Revolutionaries won, they suspended the elections. Correct me if I’m wrong.
 
What would happen to Mannerheim? Does he die in battle, or go underground?

Probably best way to Reds win Finnish Civil War is kill Mannerheim at battle very early. Perhaps he could be killed at Battle of Tampere. It was very disastrous and could had been victory for Reds or then Pyrrhic victory for Whites and Mannerheim being killed. This would make situation of Whites really bad. But there should be too ther factors to help Reds since they weren't as experienced with warfare, lacked of good generals and weren't really prepare to war.
 
Did anyone mention preventing the Great Depression? I'm not sure how, but that arguably set in motion the chain of events that led to WWII in both Europe and Asia. Otherwise I'd look for a PoD to preserve the Weimar Republic. Even if Hitler died though a far-right dictatorship is a plausible prospect for Germany, and otherwise a military dictatorship that increases tensions and maybe even starts a later war is more plausible than continued democracy. Perhaps then the PoD needs to be in changing the outcome of WWI, but the easier way to bring about a change there might actually be through having Germany get crushed more heavily in 1918-19.
 
Did anyone mention preventing the Great Depression? I'm not sure how, but that arguably set in motion the chain of events that led to WWII in both Europe and Asia. Otherwise I'd look for a PoD to preserve the Weimar Republic. Even if Hitler died though a far-right dictatorship is a plausible prospect for Germany, and otherwise a military dictatorship that increases tensions and maybe even starts a later war is more plausible than continued democracy. Perhaps then the PoD needs to be in changing the outcome of WWI, but the easier way to bring about a change there might actually be through having Germany get crushed more heavily in 1918-19.

If nobody's mentioned averting the Great Depression yet, that's unfortunate, since it is one of the few WWII-preventing post-1900 changes that could happen without either a different outcome to a prior war, averting a prior war, assassinating someone or preventing someone's assassination :)
Not sure how much effect it would have on Japan's trajectory in the Pacific, though - you may still have a major conflagration there, but something less than a truly global war.

Heh, this is one of the oldest still-living non-pinned threads that I can remember posting on! Kudos to @Ogrebear for creating a thread with some real staying power :D Over 6 years and still going strong...

(Incidentally, this is something of a milestone for me... Post Number 10,000 :biggrin: Figured this was as good a place as any!)
 
US stays out of WW1

Implies limits on submarine warfare by Germany.

Germany wins quasi white peace. Keeps eastern gains.

Reds deposed. Probably by joint Brit-German force.

US collects debts in colonies. Mostly in Pacific, Newfoundland and Bahamas.

Nuclear research goes slow - delay at least 25 years.
Would love to explore Brit-German alliance against the Reds.
 

Crazy Boris

Banned
Preventing WWI is the obvious choice and the elimination of fascism and communism as anything other than minor fringe groups, and would be my number one, but here’s some country-specific ones unrelated to the world wars

Haiti: avoids the Duvalier regime and becomes a major player in the Caribbean

Dominican Republic: No Trujillo and no Parsley massacres

Ireland and NI: both sides crack down on militias and their sympathizers early on and prevent the troubles, Ireland maintains commonwealth membership

Spain: no Second Republic or Franco

Portugal: No 1910 coup or Estado Novo, no colonial wars

The Baltics, Poland, Belarus, Ukraine, the Caucasus, and Central Asia: peacefully gain independence under the leadership of native nobility

Ottomans: No 1908 revolution, no young Turks or three pashas, sultanate gives autonomy to Arab and Christian regions and pursued a policy of multiculturalism.

India: independence is gained in the 1920s-30s as an unpartitioned federal union with the head of state rotating between maharajas of the major princely states like Malaysia

Sikkim, Tuva , and Tibet: survive

China: Xinhai revolution is crushed, the Qing survives and makes necessary modernization reforms without conceding anything to republicans.

Japan: Taisho democracy continues as usual, emperor Showa prevents military seizure of power, no invasion of China

Korea: Maintains independence under the Yi dynasty but with close ties to both China and Japan

Vietnam: Gains independence as an independent and neutral monarchy under Bao Dai with a non-communist Ho as PM (also keeps Laos and Cambodia safe with no Indochina wars)

Indonesia: gains independence peacefully with a similar structure to India, no invasions of Timor or Papua

South Africa: Apartheid stopped in its tracks before 1948 and the government adopts an egalitarian mindset to all population groups

Rwanda and Burundi: monarchies survive, legal equality of ethnic groups enshrined in law, no genocides come anywhere close to happening

Uganda: Mutesa II isnt deposed, develops a system similar to India and Indonesia

Most African countries: decolonization is done smoother and results in pre-colonial states being restored instead of unstable new republics

American Samoa: the Tu’i Manua line isn’t abolished by the USA

USA: Jim Crow laws abolished by federal government, autonomy of Native American nations guaranteed. The KKK is forcibly dismantled by the 1910s. political polarization never happens, radical populism and intersectionality theory disappear before they ever have a chance to gain ground. Statehood for Hawaii comes with restoration of Hawaiian monarchy as symbolic figureheads.

Brazil: referendum to restore monarchy succeeds, corruption is stamped out, Native autonomy and environmental protection guaranteed by law.
 
Ireland and NI: both sides crack down on militias and their sympathizers early on and prevent the troubles, Ireland maintains commonwealth membership
The Troubles originated in NI, not sure how you think the Republic was involved in the events that caused the Civil Rights movement to spiral into the Troubles. As to staying in the Commonwealth, not sure why people always want that, we effectively absented ourselves long before we left, but simple solution is have India become a Republic first.
 

Crazy Boris

Banned
The Troubles originated in NI, not sure how you think the Republic was involved in the events that caused the Civil Rights movement to spiral into the Troubles. As to staying in the Commonwealth, not sure why people always want that, we effectively absented ourselves long before we left, but simple solution is have India become a Republic first.

The Troubles may have been mostly centered in NI, but that doesn’t mean the south can’t help out in stamping out the republican militias operating from their own territory for everyone’s benefit.

As for the commonwealth, what can I say, I like international cooperation and friendship. India’s not drinking the republican kool-aid here, republicanism as a whole is pretty much dying in this scenario, especially in the old world. Ireland could get in on the action by instating the Baron Inchiquin as a new high king upon the end of the Free State period, as was proposed at the time.
 
Have Benito Mussolini get killed by the mortar bomb in 1917 that wounded him in real life. Without Mussolini, the 1922 March on Rome never happens, and Italy never becomes a fascist dictatorship. Without Fascist Italy and the March on Rome, Adolf Hitler never attempts the Beer Hall Putsch and never becomes dictator of Germany, remaining a failed artist whose extremist politics alienate everyone around him. Without Nazi Germany, World War II would be a global war against communism rather than fascism. In the wake of the Allied victory, democracy would become the sole legitimate form of government across the world and the post-WWII era would be a period of unprecedented peace and global cooperation that would continue to this day.
 
Have Benito Mussolini get killed by the mortar bomb in 1917 that wounded him in real life. Without Mussolini, the 1922 March on Rome never happens, and Italy never becomes a fascist dictatorship. Without Fascist Italy and the March on Rome, Adolf Hitler never attempts the Beer Hall Putsch and never becomes dictator of Germany, remaining a failed artist whose extremist politics alienate everyone around him. Without Nazi Germany, World War II would be a global war against communism rather than fascism. In the wake of the Allied victory, democracy would become the sole legitimate form of government across the world and the post-WWII era would be a period of unprecedented peace and global cooperation that would continue to this day.
Hitler's rise was not primarily from the example of Mussolini. It primarily rose from the situation in Germany which would have been dire even without fascism in Italy. Also Hitler did not get his extreme anti-Semitism from Italian fascism; he got it from pre-existing movements in Germany. As to the Beer Hall Putsch, this was Hitler working with the then much better known General Ludendorff. And read Main Kampf: its ideas are very different from those of Mussolini. The one thing they fully shared was the idea of cracking down on domestic communist movements, hardly unusual for most countries in the 1920s and 30s.

Without Mussolini, unless he had been replaced by another authoritarian leader, Britain may not have had to spend three years focussed on the Mediterranean and could have sent troops to the Mid and Far East across the Med without having to go around southern Africa. Might have sent more forces to the Far East and thus save Malaya, Singapore and Burma, if war with Japan had not been butterflied away. Also, a lot of the effort for defending Egypt could have been steered into winning the Battle of the Atlantic earlier. If Hitler had attacked the Soviets in this timeline, the Brits would have more resources to bomb Nazi forces in Western Europe and thus make the Nazis keep more of the Luftwaffe in the West. The Brits also could possibly attack in northern Norway once again (assuming they had been driven out in early 1940 in this time line), making it easier to send weapons and supplies to the Soviets.

As to the effect on France, I don't want to comment without a fully worked out timeline.
 
Have Benito Mussolini get killed by the mortar bomb in 1917 that wounded him in real life. Without Mussolini, the 1922 March on Rome never happens, and Italy never becomes a fascist dictatorship. Without Fascist Italy and the March on Rome, Adolf Hitler never attempts the Beer Hall Putsch and never becomes dictator of Germany, remaining a failed artist whose extremist politics alienate everyone around him. Without Nazi Germany, World War II would be a global war against communism rather than fascism. In the wake of the Allied victory, democracy would become the sole legitimate form of government across the world and the post-WWII era would be a period of unprecedented peace and global cooperation that would continue to this day.

Wouldn't some another fascist just take his place /altough this replacement is probably smarter and more competent) or then communists take power?

And I doubt that Mussolini's death would avoid Hitler's rise to power. Yes, Nazism took lot of influence from Italian fascism but it was still basically German ultra-nationalism which rose from humiliating terms of Treaty of Versailles.
 

Crazy Boris

Banned
Wouldn't some another fascist just take his place /altough this replacement is probably smarter and more competent) or then communists take power?

And I doubt that Mussolini's death would avoid Hitler's rise to power. Yes, Nazism took lot of influence from Italian fascism but it was still basically German ultra-nationalism which rose from humiliating terms of Treaty of Versailles.

Mussolini first developed fascism around 1919, so if he dies in 1917, there are no other fascists to replace him.
 

TheSpectacledCloth

Gone Fishin'
There ends up being no fog November 8th, 1939, so Georg Elser's assassination plot being successful and killing everyone inside. This would not only kill Hitler, but also Goebbels, Hess, Himmler, Heydrich, Ley, Rosenberg, Streicher and Esser. This would essentially cripple the Nazi civilian government and decapitate the SS.

Goering would be the only viable high-ranking Nazi left. He would've certainly continued the war and all of the war events involving Germany would've been nearly identical to how they played out OTL, right up to Operation Barbarossa. Goering would've obliged to invade the Soviet Union because of his loyalty to Hitler, but his war goals would be much smaller. He would've sought a similar peace to the Brest-Litovsk treaty, which was what Stalin reportedly offered during the first weeks of Barbarossa. Goering would accept this, (temporarily) gain new puppet states in the East and he would win even more popularity from the German people.

But most importantly, there would be no Holocaust ATL. While Goering certainly would've continued to plunder the Jews under Nazi occupation and have no qualms about placing them in deplorable living conditions, he likely wouldn't find it necessary to systemically kill them on an industrial level. And with Himmler and Heydrich dead, he would be under no pressure to undertake any genocidal policy against the Jews. He'd likely just force them to work in factories and/or camps (along with many of the Reich's new slaves) not only for the war effort but for the luxury for the German people and especially himself, because Goering was an amoral thief.

Speaking of war, Goering would also foolishly declare war on the United States after Pearl Harbor (he encouraged Hitler to do so OTL) because of his planet-sized ego and his ever-growing decadence. Todt would still die in a plane crash in February of 1942, but Goering wouldn't promote his irrelevant rival Speer to the post of Armaments Minister. Instead, Goering would take the job himself and while he certainly wasn't bad at it, he wouldn't be quite as competent and ruthless as OTL Speer. And von Ribbentrop would've been ousted as soon as Goering took power, so he's a nobody at this point.

While Germany would certainly do better in the North African campaign due to more manpower being available, they could only prolong the war for so long because of logistical concerns and because of the combined incompetence of Goering, Keitel, Jodl, Halder and von Brauchitsch. This would be further compounded by Darlan and the Vichy French still voluntarily giving up in November 1942 after Operation Torch, which would still lead Case Anton being implemented. While the Germans could've held on to Tunisia a little further into June of 1943, they eventually would've been outmatching and a lot more German soldiers would have ended up captured because of the extra amount of manpower and because Goering wouldn't be competent enough to successfully evacuate most of them. He probably would've written them off in an eulogizing and patronizing speech (like he did after Stalingrad OTL).

Goering would allow von Brauchitsch to retire and would foolishly take the role of Commander-in-Chief himself, because of his increasing megalomania and his growing morphine addiction. The Allies would've invaded Sicily in July and Mussolini would've still been overthrown, but the Germans would've have had a much better performance against the Allies in Italy, at least initially. But that's when Goering gets blindsided by a Soviet preemptive attack in August, approximately 2 years after the armistice agreement. The Germans get pounded by the much-improved Red Army, along with revolts within the Reich's eastern puppet states and within their concentration camps in the East. Despite these revolts being possible thanks to Goering's lackadaisical and corrupt policies, he would put the blame on the relatively weak SS and have them purged by the Wehrmacht. These setbacks, along with the continued bombing of German cities and the rapid destruction of the Luftwaffe, Goering's popularity would plummet.

Martin Bormann, who Goering would've had to keep around because of his connections within the Party, would've sensed that Goering was vulnerable and plan on overthrowing the fat man. And Bormann would have no trouble convincing the Wehrmacht to do it, since they would fed up with Goering at this point. But Bormann, knowing that he would not be viable as Fuhrer, would convince Speer to take the public role while Bormann would hold the real power. So, on November 1943, Goering would placed under house arrest and be forced to resign as Fuhrer for the safety of him and his family. While Speer's ascendance would see an improvement for the armaments industry, it was already too late by this point.

Germany would be able to hold out until early July of 1945, when it becomes clear to Speer and the Wehrmacht realize that the war was lost. Bormann refuses to surrender, so he gets removed from power. The Germans surrender on July 4th, and their post-war division is roughly the same as OTL. The Nuremberg Trials would still happen, but it would be substantially less damaging for the Germans without the Holocaust. In the end, Goering would get a life sentence and most of the other defendants would get a variety of prison sentences.

Overall, while Elser's plot wouldn't have stopped WWII, it would've made the European front far less bloody than OTL. And more importantly, it would've prevented the worst crime in human history. While the Nazis still would've been rightfully seen as the villains of this war, they wouldn't be seen as the irredeemable monsters we know them today.
 
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There ends up being no fog November 8th, 1939, so Georg Elser's assassination plot being successful and killing everyone inside. This would not only kill Hitler, but also Goebbels, Hess, Himmler, Heydrich, Ley, Rosenberg, Streicher and Esser. This would essentially cripple the Nazi civilian government and decapitate the SS.

Goering would be the only viable high-ranking Nazi left. He would've certainly continued the war and all of the war events involving Germany would've been nearly identical to how they played out OTL, right up to Operation Barbarossa. Goering would've obliged to invade the Soviet Union because of his loyalty to Hitler, but his war goals would be much smaller. He would've sought a similar peace to the Brest-Litovsk treaty, which was what Stalin reportedly offered during the first weeks of Barbarossa. Goering would accept this, (temporarily) gain new puppet states in the Eastand he would win even more popularity from the German people.

But most importantly, there would be no Holocaust ATL. While Goering certainly would've continued to plunder the Jews under Nazi occupation and have no qualms about placing them in deplorable living conditions, he likely wouldn't find it necessary to systemically kill them on an industrial level. And with Himmler and Heydrich dead, he would be under no pressure to undertake any genocidal policy against the Jews. He'd likely just force them to work in factories and/or camps (along with many of the Reich's new slaves) not only for the war effort but for the luxury for the German people and especially himself, because Goering was an amoral thief.

Speaking of war, Goering would also foolishly declare war on the United States after Pearl Harbor (he encouraged Hitler to do so OTL) because of his planet-sized ego and his ever-growing decadence. Todt would still die in a plane crash in February of 1942, but Goering wouldn't promote his irrelevant rival Speer to the post of Armaments Minister. Instead, Goering would take the job himself and while he certainly wasn't bad at it, he wouldn't be quite as competent and ruthless as OTL Speer. And von Ribbentrop would've been ousted as soon as Goering took power, so he's a nobody at this point.

While Germany would certainly do better in the North African campaign due to more manpower being available, they could only prolong the war for so long because of logistical concerns and because of the combined incompetence of Goering, Keitel, Jodl, Halder and von Brauchitsch. This would be further compounded by Darlan and the Vichy French still voluntarily giving up in November 1942 after Operation Torch, which would still lead Case Anton being implemented. While the Germans could've held on to Tunisia a little further into June of 1943, they eventually would've been outmatching and a lot more German soldiers would have ended up captured because of the extra amount of manpower and because Goering wouldn't be competent enough to successfully evacuate most of them. He probably would've written them off in an eulogizing and patronizing speech (like he did after Stalingrad OTL).

Goering would allow von Brauchitsch to retire and would foolishly take the role of Commander-in-Chief himself, because of his increasing megalomania and his growing morphine addiction. The Allies would've invaded Sicily in July and Mussolini would've still been overthrown, but the Germans would've have had a much better performance against the Allies in Italy, at least initially. But that's when Goering gets blindsided by a Soviet preemptive attack in August, approximately 2 years after the armistice agreement. The Germans get pounded by the much-improved Red Army, along with revolts within the Reich's eastern puppet states and within their concentration camps in the East. Despite these revolts being possible thanks to Goering's lackadaisical and corrupt policies, he would put the blame on the relatively weak SS and have them purged by the Wehrmacht. These setbacks, along with the continued bombing of German cities and the rapid destruction of the Luftwaffe, Goering's popularity would plummet.

Martin Bormann, who Goering would've had to keep around because of his connections within the Party, would've sensed that Goering was vulnerable and plan on overthrowing the fat man. And Bormann would have no trouble convincing the Wehrmacht to do it, since they would fed up with Goering at this point. But Bormann, knowing that he would not be viable as Fuhrer, would convince Speer to take the public role while Bormann would hold the real power. So, on November 1943, Goering would placed under house arrest and be forced to resign as Fuhrer for the safety of him and his family. While Speer's ascendance would see an improvement for the armaments industry, it was already too late by this point.

Germany would be able to hold out until early July of 1945, when it becomes clear to Speer and the Wehrmacht realize that the war was lost. Bormann refuses to surrender, so he gets removed from power. The Germans surrender on July 4th, and their post-war division is roughly the same as OTL. The Nuremberg Trials would still happen, but it would be substantially less damaging for the Germans without the Holocaust. In the end, Goering would get a life sentence and most of the other defendants would get a variety of prison sentences.

Overall, while Elser's plot wouldn't have stopped WWII, it would've made the European front far less bloody than OTL. And more importantly, it would've prevented the worst crime in human history. While the Nazis still would've been rightfully seen as the villains of this war, they wouldn't be seen as the irredeemable monsters we know them today.

That TL would be intresting to read. I would too assume that ITTL Soviet Union is slightly weaker since it had firstly make peace with Germany and then begin attack. And Stalin might be on bit weaker position. He might too die earlier than in OTL.
 
Someone more like William Tubman, instead of William Tolbert, is Tubman's successor. More Americo-Liberian & native reconciliation. No Doe coup. Liberia strong 💪💪💪

Ik it's minor and useless but Liberia is cool
 
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